And in doing so, bring more traffic to the 'offending' thread....thanks reddirty!

Hopefully people read it and realize how horrible it is to say things like that.

See what I mean?

JU reminds me of watching Soap Opera's sporadically, you can watch today and then come back 3 months later and still follow the story line.

SSDD.....

Don't get me wrong, it is still entertaining and mentally stimulating, just formulamatic.....

As much as I hate to agree with LW, the title of the article is just that--a title. The actual article isn't one that I agree with, and I think I expressed my disagreement in a response, I don't quite remember. Either way, the article is the thing to rant against, not the title. The titles have to be either creative, weird, or incendiary if they're gonna draw readers. I don't want to get taken to task for my title "I am god." I'd rather you read the article and tear me apart for that.

In house politics is hilarious and personally I don't know why y'all taking it so seriously take a step back, cool off, and maize on through...

Seems everywhere I look the right attacks the left and vice versa (excluding some more sensible and non-attacking individuals). People are taking politics more serious than the politicians...so if you really care about it that badly and I mean really care.

Put your money where your mouth is and run...for a political seat that is or at least contribute back to the community and I don't mean taxes.

Red Cross needs volunteers, Salvation Army, others, volunteer if you truly care.

This message brought to you by Grim (Red Cross Volunteer), the American Red Cross, Salvation Army and the People for Getting People to Volunteer Inc.
- Grim

People like LittleWhip screw things up for those of us who would like to have a reasonable, civil debate on the race issue.

Civilized: 'I think immigrants should make a greater effort to adapt'
Uncivilized: 'IMMIGRANTS ASSIMILATE OR GO THE HELL HOME!'

Yes, form does matter when discussing sensitive issues like race. Philomedy, I think you've got it wrong. Titles do not *have* to be incendiary to draw readers as you claim, unless incendiary is all ya got. If you have to 'trick' readers into reading your shit, you are lame. One question: if her title is OK, then why did she change it? There was an exclamation at the end of it when she first posted, now it's a period. Small detail? Sure, but very telling.

In broad strokes, LW and I probably would agree on a lot of these issues. I have no problem with the article quoted; her incitement of hatred is another matter. Put another way: the Dutch article as quoted would be OK here in Canada as it is civilized in tone; LW's commentary could get her arrested here for inciting hatred - I'm not kidding, it does happen here.

Grim - maybe you are OK with inciting hatred against minorities but some of us aren't. We have a right - a duty - to call out the hatemongers, and you are way out of line telling us to go volunteer. FWIW, I quit my six figure consulting job in 2000 to go volunteer teaching computers in the Third World through the Canadian NetCorps program. You? Frankly, I'm tired of The Nihilists' flippant attitude about people who actually give a shit. But that's another story.

David St. Hubbins

Philomedy, I think you've got it wrong. Titles do not *have* to be incendiary to draw readers as you claim, unless incendiary is all ya got.

I did not suggest a title had to be incendiary, I just pointed out that that is one way to go. One way or the other, your title has to catch the eye. In the case of this particular article, the title was far worse than the article. All I'm saying is that the article should be the issue, not the title. From the article it was clear that LW does not stand an a rooftop telling immigrants to go the hell home.

Reply #26 By: David St. Hubbins (Anonymous) - 12/2/2004 1:39:50 AM People like LittleWhip screw things up for those of us who would like to have a reasonable, civil debate on the race issue. Civilized: 'I think immigrants should make a greater effort to adapt' Uncivilized: 'IMMIGRANTS ASSIMILATE OR GO THE HELL HOME!'

You don't like it? Then by all means don't read it!

RE: "Immigrants Assimilate Or Get The Hell Out!" Why feature this self-evidently hateful article on the front page of JoeUser? There's not even a pretense of civility in the title. From where I'm standing, JoeUser has crossed the line to becoming the house organ for extreme right wing fringe groups. Someone call David Duke and tell him there's this great blog site for people like him. Why not just go whole hog and call it "JoeRacist: Blogs for the average white supremacist"? "The enemy is among us"? Wow, if that's not meant to incite hatred against a group, then I don't know what is. Disgusted as usual at what passes for humanity here, David St. Hubbins

I enjoy, and cannot beat this dead horse enough. Freedom of speech, freedom of speech, freedom of speech! She may in fact, be wrong, (I think she is frequently,) but little whip has the right to post whatever the hell she wants on her blog as long as it isn't libelous and/or slanderous. You have the right not to read it. And unless you glossed over the article and didn't read the title, I will even admit she's fairly effective to get you to read it. Voltiare said, "I may disagree with every word you say, but I will defend, to the death, your right to say it." ...That, however, will not stop me from commenting on how wrong lw is.

I have a buddy who from the time we were just kids has mouthed off about immigrants this, immigrants that. But this same buddy of mine is the first to jump in a brawl at a club when the Gestapo-like bouncers started pounding two relatively diminutive Hispanic fellas. My buddy said that, “it just felt like the right thing to do.” Jumping in the middle.

Abstract beliefs colliding with real life situations. People are complex.

Am I the only one who views taking "credit" or purporting "blame" for National/Racial/Cultural attainment, or lack thereof, of which we, as individuals, only very recently born into the world have had no part is pure hubris?

People like to feel important. Recognition brings fulfillment. Disenfranchised people seem to group together, proclaiming the achievements of the group from which they claim to hail as their own, so as to feel important. This occurs not only with "black pride", but also occurs within sub-groups in the white community.

It just doesn’t seem conducive to individual (the only skin your going to live in) self-growth to latch onto an abstract laundry list of past achievements (scientific, cultural, religious, moral) attributed to a particular racial, ethnic, or religious group. How dose it improve your particular lot. It sounds like entitlement by proxy (feeling good by way of proxy) to an attainment whose procurement we had nothing to do with. it seems to agitate flames that I had hoped the ashes & ruins of 911 extinguished in this Great Country into which we are blessed to be born. Whaddaya gonna do?

Well, you can't hold Little Whip too responsible. She's had her brain co-opted by this guy:



Assimilate indeed...

In connection with immigration, I believe Bush takes a view frowned upon by many on the right. I believe this is the result of his life experience as a Texan. I lived a spell in San Antonio before 911. Many proud Americans in that neck of the woods (they love the Spurs); many happen to be of Mexican origin, and love, love America too.

Would die for America. In fact, I never met a Hispanic person who did not wish to learn English. In fact, they seem to be first to recognize the benefit of knowing English. Furthermore, plenty of Hispanic Americans speak fluid English and are well assimilated.

As for Texas, I miss the people, Whataburgers and Tom's ribs.

Grim - maybe you are OK with inciting hatred against minorities but some of us aren't. We have a right - a duty - to call out the hatemongers, and you are way out of line telling us to go volunteer. FWIW, I quit my six figure consulting job in 2000 to go volunteer teaching computers in the Third World through the Canadian NetCorps program. You? Frankly, I'm tired of The Nihilists' flippant attitude about people who actually give a shit. But that's another story.

Yes, I am okay with inciting hatred against minorities...NOT.

1. I am Hispanic and will always be Hispanic period.
2. Member of an Anti-Racism Organization since the age of 16 (current age 23 going on 24)
3. Medically Retired from the United States Army - Active Duty
4. Tired of hearing armchair politicians complain about chit when they don't do anything to better the environment (both nature and social) when they espouse to care for it so much.
5. Your attitude of using your volunteer role as way to browbeat people trying to make yourself sound more legitimate and better than others is wrong period.
6. LW has freedom of speech and as I pointed it out to her before when we (her and me) were discussing a related subject and brought up the US Census results, I was able to conclude as she might have, that more people who speak Spanish can speak English than those who can't in the Hispanic minority.
7. Speaking English is common sense in the United States, just like speaking Rome during the Roman Empire, English during the British Empire, Greek when Greece was big (don't forget Macedonia), etc. Personally I find it redundant and waste of our money (US Taxpayer money) to legislate common sense.
8. Next time you want to attack me really think long and hard why you want to and make it over an issue of where I am truly at fault or don't.

What next will you insinuate me of supporting or doing Socialism, Communism, Fascism (though in reality I have the heart of Anarchist but I am sick of poser Anarchist who taken up a left Agenda when Anarchy is the extreme right - no government, extreme left - all government).
Go ahead attack me again if you must, because frankly it will only further to drag this political forum down until people get really upset over the matter.

- Grim

Phil

All I'm saying is that the article should be the issue, not the title.

I was surprised when I opend JU on Thanksgiving and saw that. I know the featured articles get updated, draginol may have been having a holiday, etc. But still. Geez.

drmiller

You don't like it? Then by all means don't read it!

It was the top featured article. It was a little hard to prevent myself from eading the title and feeling pissed about it. But, yeah...I get what you're saying. I try to stear clear of articles on topics like that.

Now, to go off the topic of the thread...
LW

He even dwells on my punctuation?

You've been known to do a little of thins yourself to yours truely...

Myrrander
Very funny...!

LW

Then how come so many of them never bother? Could it be that we've made it too easy for them not to? In all our border states, everything, and i mean everything, is available in both english and spanish, including free education for the children of illegals. If we refused to provide all these things bi-lingually, i think many more would learn english, and do it fast, too.

A question, LW. Do you speak a second language? From my experience, it's intimidating as hell to speak in front of native speakers. When I'm overseas, I generally shut down, speaking as little as possible because I get so shy about it. I bother, but it's feakin' hard! I think immigrants bother, too. You may just not hear them speak that much, or see them trying to learn. I can assure you, though, they do.

About the bilingual labels and such...
When I was in France, or when I'm looking at menus in other languages, I rely on the bilingual translations to help me understand. I can't imagine how difficult it would be and how confused and frustrated I would be. And they do help me understand more French in the long run. The translations provide infomation, but the English is right next to the French. I start to pick up new vocab just from the association. It helps, not hurts. Taking that away would be a horrible idea. It wuoldn't help people learn English faster. There is English everywhere. Just listening to English speakers in life helps more than anything else.